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Russia & Ukraine War

One thing he is not is deranged, isolated by yes men yes. The only thing he respects is strength as all bullies do & fear and of course the ultimate weapon loss of his money .

There is speculation that Putin has changed significantly during his last two years of isolation due to the pandemic. That is where the deranged theory came from. He has always been surrounded by yes men, but he used to be more rational and prone to avoid taking risks in his history of decision making.
 
There is speculation that Putin has changed significantly during his last two years of isolation due to the pandemic. That is where the deranged theory came from. He has always been surrounded by yes men, but he used to be more rational and prone to avoid taking risks in his history of decision making.

Yes. I've heard that too.
 
But you could be right KG. And maybe the prices Putin asks for would be enough to end the war.

I wanted to come back to this point because we in the West are still trying to read Putin's mind. Personally I don't trust him at all. He has tried to play us for suckers for years. I don't think we can trust anything he says. He lies all the time. Just like his foreign minister. Every time I think of his supposed conditions for ending the war... Ukrainian neutrality, a promise never to join NATO, giving official recognition to Russian sovereignty over Crimea, recognizing the eastern regions as either independent countries or newly acquired Russian territory... It all smacks of appeasement and defeatism.

What Putin really wants in Ukraine is to take over the whole country again and absorb it back into the Russian sphere. That means all the way to Polish, Hungarian, Romanian, and Slovak borders. Or, short of completely reabsorbing back into Mother Russia like the old Soviet Union days...he wants to install a puppet government in Kyiv that will always do whatever he tells it to.

That was the goal of the invasion. He had this insane deluded idea that a lightning fast Russian blitzkrieg would tear into the country, that Ukrainians would welcome them with open arms, drop their weapons, treat the Russians like liberators instead of invaders, storm Kyiv right away in 2 or 3 days, either kill Zelensky or send him other supposed cowards, fascists and "drug addicted" top leaders in the government fleeing to Warsaw or London like scared rabbits, etc. As he stewed for months in his more isolated Covid paranoia, and steadily nursed his grievances over Ukraine, I think he actually started to believe his own propaganda, lies and wishful thinking about the ease of retaking all of Ukraine back into a newly reborn Soviet empire.

Although pretty much nothing went according to plan for the Russian invasion, I am extremely skeptical that Putin would end the war with virtually nothing more than the status quo ante before he invaded. He already controlled Crimea by force. The eastern regions of Ukraine were already pretty much separated from Ukrainian government control and receiving Russian aid. And Ukraine was not a member of NATO. So for Ukraine to just say they won't try to retake the eastern regions and will end any hostilities there, they'll officially recognize the Russian takeover of Crimea and promise not to join NATO...and the whole war will be over... I don't buy it at all.

Again there is that Munich analogy of the folly of appeasement. Hitler convinced other major European countries in September of 1938 (about 11 months prior to World War II) to let him just have the German speaking border areas of the Czechoslovakian Sudetenland. Of course the one country that wasn't given a vote, was Czechoslovakia! So Czechoslovakia had its border areas dismembered, in order (so it was thought and hoped) to avoid any future wars in Europe. The battle plans for the upcoming German invasions of France, England and the Soviet Union were all already written and having the final details and touches done on them in Berlin as Hitler attended this "Munich Peace Conferance". Hitler promised with this agreement regarding the Sudetenland never to seek any other future territorial changes or additions (by force or war) to the borders of Germany.

By March of 1939 Germany rolled its tanks into the capital of Prague, with the Nazis more or less taking control of the whole country. This was in direct violation of the Munich Agreement. (That's an oversimplified version. But it suffices.) World War II actually started 6 months later with the Nazi invasion of Poland on September 1, 1939.

British Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain (just off the plane in London) upon his return from the "Munich Peace Conference". In the conference Britain had agreed to and signed the Munich Agreement giving the border areas of Czechoslovakia to Hitler's Nazi Germany.


 
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Along with Britain...France and Italy also signed the Munich Agreement. The infamous Munich Peace Conference and the Munich Agreement resulting from it, would later be known in Czechoslovakia as the "Munich Betrayal".

Chamberlain spoke later that same day upon his return from Munich in front of 10 Downing Street and very famously said:


"My good friends, for the second time in our history, a British Prime Minister has returned from Germany bringing peace with honor.

I believe it is peace for our time...

Go home and get a nice quiet sleep."
 
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I wanted to come back to this point because we in the West are still trying to read Putin's mind. Personally I don't trust him at all. He has tried to play us for suckers for years. I don't think we can trust anything he says. He lies all the time. Just like his foreign minister. Every time I think of his supposed conditions for ending the war... Neutrality, a promise never to join NATO, giving official recognition to Russian sovereignty over Crimea, recognizing the eastern regions as either independent countries or newly acquired Russian territory... It all smacks of appeasement and defeatism.

What Putin really wants in Ukraine is to take over the whole country again and absorb it back into the Russian sphere. That means all the way to Polish, Hungarian, Romanian, and Slovak borders. Or, short of completely reabsorbing back into Mother Russia like the old Soviet Union days...he wants to install a puppet government in Kyiv that will always do whatever he tells it to.

That was the goal of the invasion. He had this insane deluded idea that a lightning fast Russian blitzkrieg would tear into the country, that Ukrainians would welcome them with open arms, drop their weapons, treat the Russians like liberators instead of invaders, storm Kyiv right away in 2 or 3 days, either kill Zelensky or send him other supposed cowards, fascists and "drug addicted" top leaders in the government fleeing to Warsaw or London like scared rabbits, etc. As he stewed for months in his more isolated Covid paranoia, and steadily nursed his grievances over Ukraine, I think he actually started to believe his own propaganda, lies and wishful thinking about the ease of retaking all of Ukraine back into a newly reborn Soviet empire.

Although pretty much nothing went according to plan for the Russian invasion, I am extremely skeptical that Putin would end the war with virtually nothing more than the status quo ante before he invaded. He already controlled Crimea by force. The eastern regions of Ukraine were already pretty much separated from Ukrainian government control and receiving Russian aid. And Ukraine was not a member of NATO. So for Ukraine to just say they won't try to retake the eastern regions and will end any hostilities there, they'll officially recognize the Russian takeover of Crimea and promise not to join NATO...and the whole war will be over... I don't buy it at all.

Again there is that Munich analogy of the folly of appeasement. Hitler convinced other major European countries in September of 1938 (one year prior to World War II) to let him just have the German border areas of the Czechoslovakian Sudetenland. Of course the one country that wasn't given a vote, was Czechoslovakia! So Czechoslovakia had its border areas dismembered in order (so it was thought and hoped) to avoid any future wars in Europe. Hitler promised with this agreement never to seek any other future changes or additions (by force or war) to the borders of Germany.

By March of 1939 Germany rolled into the capital of Prague, with the Nazis more or less taking control of the whole country. This was in direct violation of the Munich Agreement. (That's an oversimplified version. But it suffices.) World War II actually started 6 months later with the Nazi invasion of Poland on September 1, 1939.

British Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain (just off the plane in London) upon his return from the "Munich Peace Conference". In the conference Britain had agreed to and signed the Munich Agreement giving the border areas of Czechoslovakia to Hitler's Nazi Germany.



No question that this more negative analysis is a distinct possibility as every word you just wrote is true!
 
Big difference, Biden is not Chamberlin & has called Putin a person you can not trust.
 
Big difference, Biden is not Chamberlin & has called Putin a person you can not trust.

My concern is that if these are supposedly serious offers from Russia...and Ukraine and the West agree to officially give up all of this border territory and a promise never to admit Ukraine into NATO as the price for a Russian withdrawal right now... What's to stop Putin from waiting another 1-5 years and trying to roll tanks back into Kyiv again? He's not the type of guy to honestly settle for a slice of a pie. He wants the whole pie. It's not like we're dealing with an honest, even-tempered and honorable person here. It's Vladimir Putin for cryin' out loud. If we fall for this or give into this, we could really get played as total chumps.

If it was in my control I would tell Putin to go pack sand. The only hope of keeping the Baltic States and other parts of Europe safe from Putin's future adventurism and empire building, is to keep Russia bogged down for some time in a counter-insurgency war in Ukraine. I don't like the sound of that either. But to just settle with him right now, all on his own terms by the way, and let him decide when he can just walk away...after all the devastation he's already wrought... It just seems like a reward for extremely bad behavior to put it mildly. And it will project a dangerous sign of Western weakness that he will not hesitate to test again later in the future.

China is watching all of this too. And China has its eyes on Taiwan.

It's dangerous for the U.S. to let a warmonger just wage brutal war, toss him some treats to get him to pretend to play nice again, and just let him retreat to his den unscathed.
 
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There is apparently some optimism about the upcoming negotiations today at 4:30 am EDT. I just hope that Ukraine doesn't give away the store just to get Putin to back down. This is the war that Ukraine is actually winning, in spite of all the loss of life. I understand any desire to end a war quickly. But if it's all a just a ruse and a play for time on the part of Russia to withdraw, learn from all the many mistakes it's made in the here and now...and just come back a year or more down the road with better plans to conquer the whole country... It's not worth it at all. Not worth it.

The next war Ukraine finds itself in, it may not have some of the same advantages and strong leadership that it does right now. Ukraine can't count on having the Russian army at such a disadvantage in a future conflict. They really could lose everything, cease to exist as an independent country, and become just a vassal state to Mother Russia. Which is what Putin really wants and has wanted all along since before he even started the war.

Peace is wonderful. The stopping of killing and the killing of innocents is wonderful. But peace at any price is not worth it if it means totally caving in and appeasing the aggressor with everything he claims to want. History shows that it all but guarantees even more future conflict.
 
Next war, we are far from thru this one so a bit too early to go there!
 
Buildings can be rebuilt, Ukrainians have something the Russians will never destroy their identity & resole.
 
I wanted to get back to that leaked "whistleblower" letter. Let's take a look at another section of it.

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"I can't tell you what guided those at the top when deciding on the operation, but now they are methodically lowering all the dogs on us (the Service). We are scolded for analytics - this is very in my profile, so I will explain what is wrong.

Recently, we have been increasingly pressed to customize reports to the requirements of management - I once touched on this topic. All these political consultants, politicians and their retinue, influence teams - all this created chaos. Strong.

Most importantly, no one knew that there would be such a war, they hid it from everyone. And here's an example for you: you are asked (conditionally) to calculate the possibility of human rights protection in different conditions, including the attack of prisons by meteorites. You specify about meteorites, they tell you - this is so, reinsurance for calculations, nothing like this will happen. You understand that the report will be just for show, but you need to write in a victorious style so that there are no questions, they say, why do you have so many problems, did you really work badly."

************************************************************************

This is pretty straightforward in spite of the clunky translation. So apparently in the FSB they were not asked for analytics on a hypothetical war in Ukraine. Even they were lied to or given the impression that the troop buildup was just being used as a tool of saber rattling. They also thought it was just to intimidate and try to get concessions from Ukraine without an actual invasion. There was no planning from the civilian side of the government on how to coordinate the war, how to best be prepared for consequences such as how to deal with the possible sanctions, etc. Since Putin thought he could take over most of the country and overthrow the Zelensky government in 3 days or so, nobody seemed to have a plan for the longer term. And since those at the very top are looking for scapegoats from within, they are blaming analysts at the FSB for not warning them of possible battlefield weaknesses, or having plans on the shelf ready to deal with any possible setbacks in the war.

So there's a shitstorm of angry finger-pointing landing on the FSB.

The other complaint he brings up is that the corporate culture and political climate there is so muzzled of free speech and honesty, that reports that give or predict bad news are highly frowned upon. And it's possibly even dangerous for them personally to try to send certain kinds of bad news or pessimistic assessments to the tyrannical bosses upstairs. So more often than not, they are forced to lie and give rosy assessments (that they know are b.s.) just to keep their heads down and keep their jobs.
 
Called human nature, same all over & the worst when as here misused.
 
Here's some news on Russia's plans for its wheat harvest this season.


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Reuters

Russia temporarily bans grain exports to ex-Soviet countries


(Reuters) -Russia on Monday temporarily banned grain exports to ex-Soviet countries and most sugar exports, but a senior minister said it would keep on providing special export licences to traders within its current quota.

Russia is the world's largest wheat exporter with Egypt and Turkey among the main buyers. It competes mainly with the European Union and Ukraine.

Prime Minister Mikhail Mishustin on Monday signed an order banning the export of white and raw sugar until Aug. 31, and banning wheat, rye, barley and maize exports to neighbouring Eurasian Economic Union states until June 30.

Deputy Prime Minister Viktoria Abramchenko, however, said the export of grain within the quota under individual licences would continue to be allowed.

Moscow last week voiced concern about the quick pace of its grain exports to neighbouring ex-Soviet countries, with which it shares free customs zones under the Eurasian Economic Union. Supplies to the union are not subject to Russia's grain export quotas and current taxes.

The measures were adopted "to protect the domestic food market in the face of external constraints," the government statement said.

European wheat prices rose on Monday after Interfax news agency reported on Russia's bank on grain exports. It did not initially mention the exclusions from the ban.

The government made no mention of the export licenses in its statement either, but said that international transit of grain via the Union would be allowed.

Russian wheat exports are down by 45% since the start of the current July-June marketing season because of a smaller crop, grain export taxes, and the export quota set at 11 million tonnes of grain, including 8 million tonnes of wheat, for Feb. 15-June 30.

The country still has 6 million to 6.5 million tonnes of wheat to export until June 30, Dmitry Rylko, head of the IKAR agriculture consultancy, said.

($1 = 0.9111 euros)

(Reporting by Michael Hogan in Hamburg, Sybille de La Hamaide in Paris and Conor Humphries in Dublin; Editing by Jan Harvey, Nick Macfie, Jane Merriman, Richard Chang and Tim Ahmann)

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Source: https://www.yahoo.com/news/russia-may-suspend-grain-exports-151503504.html
 
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So here we have some proof and confirmation that the analyst was right about the fact that the yield of Russian crops was going to be down this year over previous years. And he's predicting (very reasonably) that Ukraine's harvests this year will be down significantly, possibly to near zero. It's doubtful (or at best, iffy) that Ukraine will be able to produce enough food to even feed its own people this year. Let alone have any extra surplus to export, as it usually does.

So there are at least two things going on with these Russian announcements regarding the sale of their agricultural exports this year. One is that they are flexing their muscles to show that even in spite of severe sanctions on them, they have some economic leverage of their own on the world stage that they can use to reward and punish other countries with too. They know there are going to be problems, shortages, and possibly famine with Ukraine's exports not happening this year.

The other speaks to the common human fear worldwide whenever there are rumors, predictions or proof of "food scarcity" on the global markets. Countries that are net exporters of grains and produce grow more cautious, and typically less generous in how much they'll sell abroad. There is an instinctive reflex, even by food secure exporting countries, to hold back more food supply for their own people and internal domestic consumption. These countries feel the pressure to store and hold on to more grains in silos and so on, (things that won't spoil), just in case they have lower crop yields, drought or whatever, of their own next year. So the cycle worsens on its own just by the reaction of fear and caution.
 
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The village my father's family comes from is just across the Hungarian border from Ukraine. I have met many Ukrainians and become friends with some. They are good people and proud of their country. They also are not too fond of the Russians who have a slang term for Ukrainians which translates as "little Russians". Ukrainians have also not forgotten the Holodomor, the planned famine imposed on Ukraine by the Russians under Stalin in the 1930s.

I wish them all the best as the fact is, as valiant as they are, the Russians are far stronger militarily and will occupy the country unless something miraculous happens.

From Wiki:

"Holodomor

The Holodomor, also known as the Terror-Famine or the Great Famine, was a famine in Soviet Ukraine from 1932 to 1933 that killed millions of Ukrainians. The term Holodomor emphasises the famine's man-made and allegedly intentional aspects such as rejection of outside aid, confiscation of all household foodstuffs and restriction of population movement. As a large part of the wider Soviet famine of 1932–1933 which affected the major grain-producing areas of the country, millions of inhabitants of Ukraine, the majority of whom were ethnic Ukrainians, died of starvation in a peacetime catastrophe unprecedented in the history of Ukraine. Since 2006, the Holodomor has been recognized by Ukraine and 15 other countries as a genocide of the Ukrainian people carried out by the Soviet government."

Source:
https://www.bing.com/search?q=Wiki+...ge..69i57j69i64.13488j0j1&FORM=ANAB01&PC=HCTS

There's more I can add to the meaning of the term "Holodomor". I meant to add it earlier.

Again, from Wiki:

"Etymology

Holodomor literally translated from Ukrainian means "death by hunger", "killing by hunger, killing by starvation",[26] or sometimes "murder by hunger or starvation."[24] It is a compound of the Ukrainian holod, 'hunger'; and mor, 'plague'. The expression moryty holodom means "to inflict death by hunger." The Ukrainian verb moryty (морити) means "to poison, to drive to exhaustion, or to torment." The perfective form of moryty is zamoryty, 'kill or drive to death by hunger, exhausting work.'[citation needed] In English, the Holodomor has also been referred to as the artificial famine, famine genocide, terror famine, and terror-genocide.[27]"

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor#Etymology

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Will history repeat itself with another Holodomor visited upon Ukraine by Russia under yet another tyrant?
 
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