BP and the Oil Spill

[jwglass]

so, i'm curious what everyones thoughts are on the oil spill. i had a conversation with a few of my friends and my mother about whether or not BP is handling this situation the way they should and taking responsibility. the question then came up about whether or not you would feel right buying products and gas from a BP station. i personally dont care what the price is or how much cheaper they might be, i would never buy from them again, and my mother agrees with me, which surpised me being she will save a penny wherever she can. just curious on where everyone else stands.

 

[carking1]

I'd like to offer another insight. The offshore rig explosion occured about 2 weeks after President Obama signed authorization to further explore offshore drilling. How many of you think that this is a coincidence, or, like me, sabotage in order to undermine and embarrass our president? Bear in mind that George W. Bush comes from an oil family who got megarich while in office while we were paying $4.00 and better for a gallon of gas.

Guess there is no question now about where I stand politically. I was born and raised a Republican, but saw our nation go to hell during the 8 years of W's ineptness (or is he smarter than he appears?).

To answer your question, I don't think BP had anything to do with the explosion.

 

[jwglass]

I'd like to offer another insight. The offshore rig explosion occured about 2 weeks after President Obama signed authorization to further explore offshore drilling. How many of you think that this is a coincidence, or, like me, sabotage in order to undermine and embarrass our president? Bear in mind that George W. Bush comes from an oil family who got megarich while in office while we were paying $4.00 and better for a gallon of gas.

Guess there is no question now about where I stand politically. I was born and raised a Republican, but saw our nation go to hell during the 8 years of W's ineptness (or is he smarter than he appears?).

To answer your question, I don't think BP had anything to do with the explosion.

i'm not saying they had anything to do with it, but i believe they need to fess up about what went wrong. it seems like we get so many different answers about whats going on and how bad it is. and nobody is stepping up for the blame. this is going to bankrupt the fishing industries on the coast. they are just now recovering from hurricane katrina, and now they are getting fisted by BP's irresponsibility. thats my opinion. i think sabbatoge is a little strong of a case. obama took a risk, at least thats more than GWB did, instead of getting up immediately to address 9-11 he sat there reading to children. thanks a lot GW, you fucked our country and now the peeps that are trying to fix it are getting fucked

 

[joninliverton]

I've been waiting for someone to start a thread on this and quite surprised that it's taken so long. Whilst BP has to and have taken the ultimate responsibility for this disaster, I do fear that Obama has shown his inexperience in office and politics by bringing the "british" element into the equation. The interpretation of his alleged anti British remarks have caused quite a stir in the UK and the anti war/anti american brigade were quick to latch on to this. This also came at a time where a new coalition govt has just taken office over here so it's not a good start between the two govts, which of course traditional have been in great support of each other.

BP have stated that they will fix the problem and foot the bill for the environmental disaster and their chairman was brave enough to go in front of the hearing this week and get mauled by those people who have probably made lots of money from the oil game in the first place.

It's easy to sit in your big leather chairs and look down and maul a CEO after the event and I personally thought the CEO took it well. However, Joe you gotta remember that BP employed about 3 American companies to run operations and maintain the rig so there are more companies to point the finger at in this scenario.

Don't cut off your nose to spite your face and if there is cheaper fuel somewhere then take it.

 

[Denny Bear]

I hope I don't get earmarked as anti American but I am a bit divided on this whole thing. I am glad to see that so far BP is some what stepping up to the plate to pay the bills as they obviously goofed big time, and somebody has to pay the piper. But frankly, I think the fault lies on all of us and the looser here is the planet. In this country everything we do is based on our capitalist system and we have learned to be dam greedy because of it. We burn our resources like there is no tomorrow and bitch like crazy if the price goes up. Mean while the bean counters sit counting their beans stashing away as many as they can. No one does anything if it don't make a profit and the minute it does they have to find a way to do it cheaper so they can make a bigger profit. Everyone keeps talking about budget cut backs and how we need to cut the fat all the time and I am sick of hearing it. Government and industry has cut things down so much there is not enough material left in the walls to hold the roof up. So along comes BP and does the same thing everyone else is doing, they just happen to be in the house when the roof caved in. We need to get over this greedy streak and be willing to pay for things to be done right.

But as I said the bad part of this is the looser, our beautiful planet. The damage being done by this is absolutely unbelievable and we will never fully get over it. The scary thing is nature has a way of taking care of itself. Given enough time nature can evolve around almost any infestation. What makes this scary is that in this case the infestation is us. We keep doing stuff to mess with nature one day soon nature will do start doing things to us.

 

[joninliverton]

I hope I don't get earmarked as anti American but I am a bit divided on this whole thing. I am glad to see that so far BP is some what stepping up to the plate to pay the bills as they obviously goofed big time, and somebody has to pay the piper. But frankly, I think the fault lies on all of us and the looser here is the planet. In this country everything we do is based on our capitalist system and we have learned to be dam greedy because of it. We burn our resources like there is no tomorrow and bitch like crazy if the price goes up. Mean while the bean counters sit counting their beans stashing away as many as they can. No one does anything if it don't make a profit and the minute it does they have to find a way to do it cheaper so they can make a bigger profit. Everyone keeps talking about budget cut backs and how we need to cut the fat all the time and I am sick of hearing it. Government and industry has cut things down so much there is not enough material left in the walls to hold the roof up. So along comes BP and does the same thing everyone else is doing, they just happen to be in the house when the roof caved in. We need to get over this greedy streak and be willing to pay for things to be done right.

But as I said the bad part of this is the looser, our beautiful planet. The damage being done by this is absolutely unbelievable and we will never fully get over it. The scary thing is nature has a way of taking care of itself. Given enough time nature can evolve around almost any infestation. What makes this scary is that in this case the infestation is us. We keep doing stuff to mess with nature one day soon nature will do start doing things to us.

Super post Denny, you've hit the nail on the head there. But it aint just the USA matey, it's all the capitalist states in this goddamn greedy world of ours. Our new PM David Cameron hasn't gone down too well over here because he said he's gonna make 6 billion pounds saving in the next 12 months and he's had to cancel lots of projects already. So everyone over here is gonna have to tighten their belts and bite the bullet.

 

[tampa24]

Super post Denny, you've hit the nail on the head there. But it aint just the USA matey, it's all the capitalist states in this goddamn greedy world of ours. Our new PM David Cameron hasn't gone down too well over here because he said he's gonna make 6 billion pounds saving in the next 12 months and he's had to cancel lots of projects already. So everyone over here is gonna have to tighten their belts and bite the bullet.

I had indeed considered starting another thread about he oil spill. But I'm glad that at least somebody did. Thanks JW. I definitely understand the anger of those who say they will never buy from BP again. In the long term though I don't think that any boycott will amount to much. Oil and gasoline are such fungible commodities that it's hard to know with certainty in many convenience stores or mom and pop little gas stations just which company processed the fuel going into your tank.

Tony Hayward's performance before Congress did not go over well. He took the defense of the entire company and twisted it into how he couldn't explain any thing that went wrong because he was out of the loop. He just kept saying how as head honcho he knew no of the details of the day to day operations of one rig out of hundreds in far flung places all over the globe. It certainly didn't inspire much confidence that those hundreds of other BP rigs all over the globe are being run any more safely.

Of course as CEO he would not be fed info about a particular rig's problems, delays and progress. But you can be sure that since the accident that he has been getting internal briefings in great detail about what events led up to the explosion and collapse of the platform. To ask any sane adult to believe that he still has no knowledge of what mistakes were made leading up to the massive spill is laughable.

But of course he was doing what his lawyers told him to do. Express regret but take no blame. Nor give any details as to how BP screwed up. Because they know that every sentence he says will be submitted in court for decades to come as people continually sue BP for damages.

 

[mikeyank]

I'd like to offer another insight. The offshore rig explosion occurred about 2 weeks after President Obama signed authorization to further explore offshore drilling. How many of you think that this is a coincidence, or, like me, sabotage in order to undermine and embarrass our president? Bear in mind that George W. Bush comes from an oil family who got megarich while in office while we were paying $4.00 and better for a gallon of gas.

Interesting perspective carking. I've been surprised as to the extent of Obama bashing by the right wing Republicans, since he was elected President. I used to occasionally watch Fox News just for laughs, watching them twist everything to make Obama look like a left wing, radical, socialist, with a "hidden agenda".

So while I had not considered what you suggest carking, I wouldn't put it past the Obama haters to do whatever it takes to bring him down. Thank you for offering this perspective.

 

[jwglass]

I've been waiting for someone to start a thread on this and quite surprised that it's taken so long. Whilst BP has to and have taken the ultimate responsibility for this disaster, I do fear that Obama has shown his inexperience in office and politics by bringing the "british" element into the equation. The interpretation of his alleged anti British remarks have caused quite a stir in the UK and the anti war/anti american brigade were quick to latch on to this. This also came at a time where a new coalition govt has just taken office over here so it's not a good start between the two govts, which of course traditional have been in great support of each other.

BP have stated that they will fix the problem and foot the bill for the environmental disaster and their chairman was brave enough to go in front of the hearing this week and get mauled by those people who have probably made lots of money from the oil game in the first place.

It's easy to sit in your big leather chairs and look down and maul a CEO after the event and I personally thought the CEO took it well. However, Joe you gotta remember that BP employed about 3 American companies to run operations and maintain the rig so there are more companies to point the finger at in this scenario.

Don't cut off your nose to spite your face and if there is cheaper fuel somewhere then take it.

i understand what youre saying, one of the 3 american contractors was haliberton, which is basically all the same major players in enron, but they have still not stepped up and said what can be done to keep this from happeneing again. they are willing to buy people out, and in the long run that isnt going to do anything. not only is this going to destroy industry in the gulf, its going to creep up the east coast. they are projecting that it will reach the carolinas, which are a huge vacation spot. North Carolina has beachfront properties that will be uterly useless. the thing about that is that in North Carolina, the whole coast is vacation properties, that are going to turn into a ghost town.

I believe you are right denny, we are greedy. all we do, we do for money. my family is about to drop a large sum of money on installing a geothermal heat pump and i am super excited for that. not only will that save us money, but the technology is a great way to start going green and lessening our carbon footprint. even with this going on, in the area i live, i practically see a hummer for every 3 vehicles. its insane that uppermiddle class white people feel the need to drive a military vehicle to transport their little brats back and forth to soccer practice. for this reason exactly i have vowed never to bring new children into this world. i believe we are headed down a road of disaster. by all means i will adopt the children already alive and in this world, but as for new children, i dont want to bring anyone into this ticking time bomb that i dont have to.

 

[joninliverton]

i understand what youre saying, one of the 3 american contractors was haliberton, which is basically all the same major players in enron, but they have still not stepped up and said what can be done to keep this from happeneing again. they are willing to buy people out, and in the long run that isnt going to do anything. not only is this going to destroy industry in the gulf, its going to creep up the east coast. they are projecting that it will reach the carolinas, which are a huge vacation spot. North Carolina has beachfront properties that will be uterly useless. the thing about that is that in North Carolina, the whole coast is vacation properties, that are going to turn into a ghost town.

I believe you are right denny, we are greedy. all we do, we do for money. my family is about to drop a large sum of money on installing a geothermal heat pump and i am super excited for that. not only will that save us money, but the technology is a great way to start going green and lessening our carbon footprint. even with this going on, in the area i live, i practically see a hummer for every 3 vehicles. its insane that uppermiddle class white people feel the need to drive a military vehicle to transport their little brats back and forth to soccer practice. for this reason exactly i have vowed never to bring new children into this world. i believe we are headed down a road of disaster. by all means i will adopt the children already alive and in this world, but as for new children, i dont want to bring anyone into this ticking time bomb that i dont have to.

We all kick off when something like this happens and vow never to do this or do that again. Then after a few months or in some cases a few years and it is forgotten about.

I'm pretty surprised at Tampa's post though. Within such a vast organisation the CEO will know nothing about the day to day operations of a rig. This is done by local contractors who employ local people, imagine the stink if all BP's rigs were manned by British people, there would be massive outcry. I'm sure that whilst BP are taking the wrap, they will also be suing the local companies for not doing their jobs correctly and, if the lawsuits are that expensive then these local companies may well go out of business, which means the local people will be out of work. Swings and roundabouts comes to mind.

 

[Denny Bear]

An interesting outlook on the matter from You Tube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NVjrXGkHoo

 

[tampa24]

We all kick off when something like this happens and vow never to do this or do that again. Then after a few months or in some cases a few years and it is forgotten about.

I'm pretty surprised at Tampa's post though. Within such a vast organisation the CEO will know nothing about the day to day operations of a rig. This is done by local contractors who employ local people, imagine the stink if all BP's rigs were manned by British people, there would be massive outcry. I'm sure that whilst BP are taking the wrap, they will also be suing the local companies for not doing their jobs correctly and, if the lawsuits are that expensive then these local companies may well go out of business, which means the local people will be out of work. Swings and roundabouts comes to mind.

Maybe I didn't convey my sentiments very well in my first post Jon. I'll try again one more time. I understand that a CEO of a major global company who sits in London or Seattle is not going to be given briefings on the daily operations of wells or factories in Kuala Lumpur or the South China Sea. That's for people under him to manage. But he and the board set the tone for how much cost cutting they feel the company can safely get away with before sacrificing worker and environmental safety. As well as how far they are willing to comply or not comply with local laws and regulations.

Everybody knows full well that he has been given daily if not hourly briefings by BP executives on exactly what went wrong, how much oil is actually spilling, etc.... If he hasn't asked for or received any of those briefings then he should be fired for incompetence. Nobody believed that he went before Congress with no knowledge of what cost cutting measures doomed the rig to collapse. Taking the lives of 11 BP employees. Nobody believed he went before Congress with no knowledge of how much oil was spilling based on internal BP studies.

He went before Congress as the representative and the top man in charge of BP. NOT as a private citizen. Yet all of his stonewalling defenses centered around his assertion that he personally was not informed of the daily operations taking place aboard the company's oil well. Therefore he had no pertinent info to share with Congress or the American people. He repeatedly said things to the effect of, "I don't know the answer to that. I'm not a geothermal engineer, I'm not a mineralogist, etc, etc..."

Well if he doesn't have the education or intelligence to process the briefings he's getting from all the college educated experts on BP's payroll then he needs to be fired for that reason alone. If he's just a bean counter shuffling papers on board the company jet, then the company doesn't need him. I happen to think that Hayward is a very intelligent guy. I think he can process those briefings just fine when they are broken down in lay persons' terms.

He made the conscious decision to go before Congress and give a general apology while giving up nothing as to what went wrong at BP that allowed the spill tp happen. That's what infuriated everybody. Because it was an insult to all of our intelligence to believe that he knew as little about the Deepwater Horizon rig as he did. Not in the months leading up to the explosion certainly. Which as CEO he would NOT have known about. But in the days and weeks afterwards. And certainly by this week when he came to Washington.

I also just wanted to say that just because people here in the States are anti-BP right now doesn't mean they are anti-British. Most Americans I know are enlightened and educated enough to differentiate one from the other. If the incompetence, greed and cost cutting measures were all the work of "rogue" American employees of BP America then Hayward should say as much and let the chips fall where they may. The American legal system will happily go after American citizens who broke the law and unleashed an environmental and economic man-made disaster on the Gulf region.

If the culture of cost cutting, greed and indifference to local laws and regulations came from the top down, then BP is definitely on the hook. Lock, stock and barrel. I'm not ready to let other American companies like Halliburton off the hook either. Halliburton brings a whole lot of very sleazy baggage to the table all by itself. Given that that greedy sleazebag Dick Cheney was CEO of Halliburton right before becoming VP... And the fact that he funneled billions and billions of dollars to HB in the form of security and reconstruction projects to them, in no bid contracts, for the war in Iraq, while still getting a pension from the company... For a war that he, Rumsfeld and Dubya personally started... The idea that HB did something illegal out in the Gulf, in non compliance of government regulations, in order to improve their own balance sheets...would surprise me not at all.

But regardless of whether the BP employees responsible the mess are American citizens, British citizens or any other...BP is still on the hook financially and legally. And Tony Hayward is smart enough to know that too.

 

[silvercamel]

Maybe I didn't convey my sentiments very well in my first post Jon. I'll try again one more time. I understand that a CEO of a major global company who sits in London or Seattle is not going to be given briefings on the daily operations of wells or factories in Kuala Lumpur or the South China Sea. That's for people under him to manage. But he and the board set the tone for how much cost cutting they feel the company can safely get away with before sacrificing worker and environmental safety. As well as how far they are willing to comply or not comply with local laws and regulations.

Everybody knows full well that he has been given daily if not hourly briefings by BP executives on exactly what went wrong, how much oil is actually spilling, etc.... If he hasn't asked for or received any of those briefings then he should be fired for incompetence. Nobody believed that he went before Congress with no knowledge of what cost cutting measures doomed the rig to collapse. Taking the lives of 11 BP employees. Nobody believed he went before Congress with no knowledge of how much oil was spilling based on internal BP studies.

He went before Congress as the representative and the top man in charge of BP. NOT as a private citizen. Yet all of his stonewalling defenses centered around his assertion that he personally was not informed of the daily operations taking place aboard the company's oil well. Therefore he had no pertinent info to share with Congress or the American people. He repeatedly said things to the effect of, "I don't know the answer to that. I'm not a geothermal engineer, I'm not a mineralogist, etc, etc..."

Well if he doesn't have the education or intelligence to process the briefings he's getting from all the college educated experts on BP's payroll then he needs to be fired for that reason alone. If he's just a bean counter shuffling papers on board the company jet, then the company doesn't need him. I happen to think that Hayward is a very intelligent guy. I think he can process those briefings just fine when they are broken down in lay persons' terms.

He made the conscious decision to go before Congress and give a general apology while giving up nothing as to what went wrong at BP that allowed the spill tp happen. That's what infuriated everybody. Because it was an insult to all of our intelligence to believe that he knew as little about the Deepwater Horizon rig as he did. Not in the months leading up to the explosion certainly. Which as CEO he would NOT have known about. But in the days and weeks afterwards. And certainly by this week when he came to Washington.

I also just wanted to say that just because people here in the States are anti-BP right now doesn't mean they are anti-British. Most Americans I know are enlightened and educated enough to differentiate one from the other. If the incompetence, greed and cost cutting measures were all the work of "rogue" American employees of BP America then Hayward should say as much and let the chips fall where they may. The American legal system will happily go after American citizens who broke the law and unleashed an environmental and economic man-made disaster on the Gulf region.

If the culture of cost cutting, greed and indifference to local laws and regulations came from the top down, then BP is definitely on the hook. Lock, stock and barrel. I'm not ready to let other American companies like Halliburton off the hook either. Halliburton brings a whole lot of very sleazy baggage to the table all by itself. Given that that greedy sleazebag Dick Cheney was CEO of Halliburton right before becoming VP... And the fact that he funneled billions and billions of dollars to HB in the form of security and reconstruction projects to them, in no bid contracts, for the war in Iraq, while still getting a pension from the company... For a war that he, Rumsfeld and Dubya personally started... The idea that HB did something illegal out in the Gulf, in non compliance of government regulations, in order to improve their own balance sheets...would surprise me not at all.

But regardless of whether the BP employees responsible the mess are American citizens, British citizens or any other...BP is still on the hook financially and legally. And Tony Hayward is smart enough to know that too.

Exactly. It's the culture he is responsible for and it has become clear that BPs culture left a lot to be desired. And this was recognized in the industry long before the tragedy of the oil spill.

 

[Denny Bear]

I understand that a CEO of a major global company who sits in London or Seattle is not going to be given briefings on the daily operations of wells or factories in Kuala Lumpur or the South China Sea.
Everybody knows full well that he has been given daily if not hourly briefings by BP executives on exactly what went wrong,

I also just wanted to say that just because people here in the States are anti-BP right now doesn't mean they are anti-British. Most Americans I know are enlightened and educated enough to differentiate one from the other. If the incompetence, greed and cost cutting measures were all the work of "rogue" American employees of BP America then Hayward should say as much and let the chips fall where they may.

Tampa I am inclined to agree with you on the thought of Hayward being given frequent briefings after the fact, as much as I can also believe he wouldn't have known shit about it before it blew up. As for his testimony let me again stick my neck out and play devils advocate. While it is very true he did more dancing around the issues then the Keystone Cops he did however do exactly what he had to do. This being the worst disaster of all time it is also going to have the largest price tag of all time. There is not a lawyer living that would have told Hayward to answer any one of the questions he was asked. Every breath he took and every gesture he made will be scrutinized for years to come trying to find a way to pin something on them. At this stage of the game he wouldn't have dared to volunteer any information. I find it hard to believe anyone in that room would have expected more then the answers they received. I am much more inclined to think that whole show was simply put on to make it look like things are being done faster then they really are.

As for the blame game let me just throw out an idea, again at the risk of sounding anti American. People in this country are used to dealing with companies like Halliburton and others that lie, cheat, and steal there way to big money. That's why it is so easy for us to instantly throw the blame at BP yelling burn the witches. We are just used to big companies trying to rip us off. The Brits on the other hand have always been men of honor and trust. Watch the old movies they will stand still and let you have the first shot. I can almost see them believing that the American companies they had contracted would act with the same honor and trust as they would have. Yes they would have been the ones that set the tone for budget cut backs and the like. But maybe they did not understand the ruthless extremes these people would go through to meet their demands and still pocket the largest profit for themselves. Yes that is extreme thinking but I offer it as just food for thought.

 

[tampa24]

Tampa I am inclined to agree with you on the thought of Hayward being given frequent briefings after the fact, as much as I can also believe he wouldn't have known shit about it before it blew up. As for his testimony let me again stick my neck out and play devils advocate. While it is very true he did more dancing around the issues then the Keystone Cops he did however do exactly what he had to do. This being the worst disaster of all time it is also going to have the largest price tag of all time. There is not a lawyer living that would have told Hayward to answer any one of the questions he was asked. Every breath he took and every gesture he made will be scrutinized for years to come trying to find a way to pin something on them. At this stage of the game he wouldn't have dared to volunteer any information. I find it hard to believe anyone in that room would have expected more then the answers they received. I am much more inclined to think that whole show was simply put on to make it look like things are being done faster then they really are.

And therein lies the rub Denny. As upset as I was with Hayward's performance he was doing what his lawyers told him to do. The whole thing was a dog and pony show for both sides. Congress had to show the American people that they were holding BP's feet to the fire. Since they kneww that they were powerless to stop the spill itself. If Hayward had said too much in the hearing he knew that it would cost the company billions more in liability awards down the road. BP knew that it had to go before Congress and issue yet another apology. While spouting company propaganda about how much they are doing, how much oil they are cleaning up and how they hope to get the leak under control very soon. All the while admitting no wrongdoing in the events leading up to the spill itself.

I guess I would have had more respect for him (Hayward) if he had just said the usual b.s. that other executives do. Like saying that their attorneys had advised them to not answer certain questions that deal with pending litigation. It was just very patronizing and insulting to our intelligence to have him saying that he had no knowledge of what events led up to the spill.

But Hayward has already been replaced as the point man for the Gulf region spill. There are many other issues involved in the spill beyond a one time event like this week's hearing. So if other people want to contribute something I'd be interested in hearing what they have to say.

 

[joninliverton]

I also just wanted to say that just because people here in the States are anti-BP right now doesn't mean they are anti-British. Most Americans I know are enlightened and educated enough to differentiate one from the other. If the incompetence, greed and cost cutting measures were all the work of "rogue" American employees of BP America then Hayward should say as much and let the chips fall where they may. The American legal system will happily go after American citizens who broke the law and unleashed an environmental and economic man-made disaster on the Gulf region.

If the culture of cost cutting, greed and indifference to local laws and regulations came from the top down, then BP is definitely on the hook. Lock, stock and barrel. I'm not ready to let other American companies like Halliburton off the hook either. Halliburton brings a whole lot of very sleazy baggage to the table all by itself. Given that that greedy sleazebag Dick Cheney was CEO of Halliburton right before becoming VP... And the fact that he funneled billions and billions of dollars to HB in the form of security and reconstruction projects to them, in no bid contracts, for the war in Iraq, while still getting a pension from the company... For a war that he, Rumsfeld and Dubya personally started... The idea that HB did something illegal out in the Gulf, in non compliance of government regulations, in order to improve their own balance sheets...would surprise me not at all.

But regardless of whether the BP employees responsible the mess are American citizens, British citizens or any other...BP is still on the hook financially and legally. And Tony Hayward is smart enough to know that too.

Agree Tampa but then I found this article to which I also agree.

"Personally, as I get older and grumpier I find myself less forgiving. The oil "spill" in the Gulf is horrendous and as someone who enjoys the sea more than most I can only imagine the horror people living on the coast are going through.

That said, a president needs to balance his language with the reality of the situation - and Obama hasn't done that. Instead he has made this out to be a problem that the Brits have inflicted and that's not helpfull and it's most definitely double standards.

Think back to the 80's when Union Carbide killed more than 8,000 people in Bopal, India. The US governement / laws have blocked / prevented anyone from standing trial for this crime... and all these years later it's still not been resolved.

BP may be in part or in whole responsible (there's still no legal outcome as to who was really to blame for what caused this mess) but they have accepted they will do all they can to remedy the "leak". Meanwhile Obama's rhetoric only drives the value of BP down and our dis-belief that the Brits are responsible"

 

[raysvq]

Getting back to your original question "Would you continue to buy BP products"
My answer to this is:-
Yes - in the short term. In order for BP to stick around & finish cleaning up the mess & compensating the innocent who have lost big time & those who will continue to lose until this mess is fixed. Once BP has met their obligations & the mess is cleaned & everybody is happy again THEN pull the plug on them.
My reason for suggesting the above is simple - while they still have an income they can afford to meet their obligations. But as soon as you stop their income they will say we can't afford to pay for this & then call in the receivers, at which point the tax payer will have to pick up the tab.
I know this sounds too simplistic but think about it.

 

[joninliverton]

Good point Ray but if we stopped buying products or using facilities from companies that have upset us then would probably end back as cave dwellers.

So are we going to stop banking with the large banks that have gotten our countries into this worldwide financial mess ? I think you will find that BP products go further than the petrol pump and you may well be consuming their products without even knowing it.

Best thing is to let them get on with it, fix the leak and get the environment back in shape.

 

[enzo]

Hi there,

I always love to put thinks into perspective, so let's share another point with you. Everyone is (with reason) angry with BP and other oil producer seem the nice guys in the meantime.

So let's talk also about Shell. They have nice rigs around a forgotten country called Nigeria, where only this year, there has been half the amount of oil you have now in the gulf of Mexico in their nice country. Now, almost no one report this because :
- I'ts Africa, and mainly nobody care about Africa (... I do not say this, but a lots of other people yes)
- It's not a "modern" country with a "democratic" governement
- The oil comes from several hundreds of small leaks due to very old and non well maintened material by Shell, so no BIG oil leak, just tons of them.
- Ho yes the best... those are poor people and Nigeria really need seeling oil to rich countries (70% of its oil goes to USA).

Having said that, I just wanted to point out the the oil industry is more "crappy" that many people seem to know and it's just the very first time that one big rich nice country is affected by this. In poor contries or non-democratic countries where thoses situations take place more often (but differently), journalist and also general opinion do not give a fuch of what is going on.

So for my part, I may boycott BP and go elsewhere, but I am pretty sure that the others are as bad or even worse than BP.

Cheers to everyone

 

[joninliverton]

Hi there,

I always love to put thinks into perspective, so let's share another point with you. Everyone is (with reason) angry with BP and other oil producer seem the nice guys in the meantime.

So let's talk also about Shell. They have nice rigs around a forgotten country called Nigeria, where only this year, there has been half the amount of oil you have now in the gulf of Mexico in their nice country. Now, almost no one report this because :
- I'ts Africa, and mainly nobody care about Africa (... I do not say this, but a lots of other people yes)
- It's not a "modern" country with a "democratic" governement
- The oil comes from several hundreds of small leaks due to very old and non well maintened material by Shell, so no BIG oil leak, just tons of them.
- Ho yes the best... those are poor people and Nigeria really need seeling oil to rich countries (70% of its oil goes to USA).

Having said that, I just wanted to point out the the oil industry is more "crappy" that many people seem to know and it's just the very first time that one big rich nice country is affected by this. In poor contries or non-democratic countries where thoses situations take place more often (but differently), journalist and also general opinion do not give a fuch of what is going on.

So for my part, I may boycott BP and go elsewhere, but I am pretty sure that the others are as bad or even worse than BP.

Cheers to everyone

Exactly Enzo. It's just that at this moment in time that BP are getting the flack. As you have stated Shell which is another conglomorate, is causing problems in Africa but no one hears about it.

It's also interesting to see that since I mentioned the Union Carbide issue that a lot of the people who were shouting off have shut up.

Today, there are a lot of people up in arms because BP CEO Tony Hayward is involved in a yatch race off the coast of Britain. So what, I remember pics and TV footage of the US president out jogging just a few days after 9/11 and other crisis, so what's the difference sport or relaxing on your so cold time off is the same no matter what you do.