Gay rights

[LesterM]

I have been debating with myself about posting this thread. I decided to go ahead.
I have gotten into discussions with Mitch and we know that there were problems there that were insurmountable by me. One of the things he wrote that bothered me tremendously was that as an older gay man he really didn't care if marriage rights were passed because he did not see that as an option for himself at this time of life. I realize that he is not here to defend that statement and I hope I am doing him justice by stating his thought as he would have stated it. If I have not I apologize.However, the problem is bigger than just a discussion here on the forum. I have spoken to other older gay men who have expressed the same opinion. If the generations before us don't care I do not see how we can win the fight for true and honest equal rights in this country. I have spoken to many other people who feel the fight involves all of us ,gay and lesbian and no matter what age and if the rights we fight for will be used or not. I feel that if we are not granted full unequivical rights we will never be given full respect and people will still panic if the word homosexual is used around children. I knew I was gay at a very early age . I was not recruited and I did not choose to be gay, it is a part of me as is my hair , eye and skin color.I am outraged that we are asked to pay full taxes with out full rights. I think it is time for all of us to band together as brothers , sisters, fathers and mothers of each other. Does anyone else feel anything about this?

 

[Markymark]

I have been debating with myself about posting this thread. I decided to go ahead.
I have gotten into discussions with Mitch and we know that there were problems there that were insurmountable by me. One of the things he wrote that bothered me tremendously was that as an older gay man he really didn't care if marriage rights were passed because he did not see that as an option for himself at this time of life. I realize that he is not here to defend that statement and I hope I am doing him justice by stating his thought as he would have stated it. If I have not I apologize.However, the problem is bigger than just a discussion here on the forum. I have spoken to other older gay men who have expressed the same opinion. If the generations before us don't care I do not see how we can win the fight for true and honest equal rights in this country. I have spoken to many other people who feel the fight involves all of us ,gay and lesbian and no matter what age and if the rights we fight for will be used or not. I feel that if we are not granted full unequivical rights we will never be given full respect and people will still panic if the word homosexual is used around children. I knew I was gay at a very early age . I was not recruited and I did not choose to be gay, it is a part of me as is my hair , eye and skin color.I am outraged that we are asked to pay full taxes with out full rights. I think it is time for all of us to band together as brothers , sisters, fathers and mothers of each other. Does anyone else feel anything about this?

The fact is Lester, that as a 54 year old man, I took personal exception to the thought that someone, who is part of a particular group, had NO concern over action taken against members of that group, because it didn't appear it would affect him. I stand firmly with you on this issue. I did not spend the last 25 years of my life fighting injustice and raising my kids to respect all people and all choices of lifestyle, just so some person can adopt what amounts to arrogance towards his own. The only excuse I can even think might be used by him is that having fought so hard to get help solving the AIDS issues, that his generation has nothing left to offer against this new challenge. But, as a member of his generation, I scream RUBBISH! True soldiers fight whatever battle they are thrown into. I did not ask to be denied my rights, but I'll be damned if someone, anyone, thinks I will accept less than total equality. This is what I wanted to say, and why I was so mad I had planned to leave the Forum. I will never accept complacency, as to do so would be the same as dying without trying to live.

Wow! Thanks, it felt good to get that off my chest!

With love, and respect for all, I am,

 

[Markymark]

God damn anyone who says that what happens to a fourteen year old gay student in Chicago who gets picked on in class or an eighty one year old gay man in Florida who gets threatened as he walks to the grocery has nothing to do with him. A drag queen who just didn't want to be arrested one more time at Stonewall made it possible for Adam and me to register in a New York hotel just as surely as Rosa Parks made it possible for Lena Horne to fly first class. And any self-loathing, arrogant, pseudo-intellectual ass who thinks he has the right to pick and choose the freedoms and individuals who deserve those freedoms, be he 18, 35, or 110, can spend his life in any Middle Eastern country of his choosing. I intend to fight with my last breath to insure that my husband and I, that our three sons, that every LGBT person I know or will ever know shares equally in the rights and responsibilities of citizenship in this country. No gay man should ever say he didn't vote or he doesn't care. I am considerably older than Markymark, but I swear, if you do, the two of us will spank your twinkie little butts. (And furthermore, speaking for myself, I will try not to enjoy it!) Marky - you must try also!

AH! Man, I never get to have fun! Seriously thiough, I did not mention the whole aspect of what fighting for our rights means to our kids, but we are giving them a good example to follow. I have a total now of 6 kids, five foster and Carl's son, who is graduating from UNM. None of them ever deny either of their dads and in fact, my two youngest both got in trouble at school when bullies told them their dad was a fag. (How the hell do you ball your kid out for fighting to defend your honor?) But I did, because fighting is never the answer. Talk about a Hollywood moment! One boy, Steven, served as lifeguard for the pool at a local gay club, and Joey, my youngest, insisted I go to class for show and tell to talk about HIV and AIDS. Its a new worldpeople. We need to stand up for our futures, and our childrens.

OK no more soapbox tonight, I'm gonna come back down to earth and go fold sox with my honey, See ya later!

Love to all, I am,

 

[Jayman01]

I have been debating with myself about posting this thread. I decided to go ahead.
I have gotten into discussions with Mitch and we know that there were problems there that were insurmountable by me. One of the things he wrote that bothered me tremendously was that as an older gay man he really didn't care if marriage rights were passed because he did not see that as an option for himself at this time of life. I realize that he is not here to defend that statement and I hope I am doing him justice by stating his thought as he would have stated it. If I have not I apologize.However, the problem is bigger than just a discussion here on the forum. I have spoken to other older gay men who have expressed the same opinion. If the generations before us don't care I do not see how we can win the fight for true and honest equal rights in this country. I have spoken to many other people who feel the fight involves all of us ,gay and lesbian and no matter what age and if the rights we fight for will be used or not. I feel that if we are not granted full unequivical rights we will never be given full respect and people will still panic if the word homosexual is used around children. I knew I was gay at a very early age . I was not recruited and I did not choose to be gay, it is a part of me as is my hair , eye and skin color.I am outraged that we are asked to pay full taxes with out full rights. I think it is time for all of us to band together as brothers , sisters, fathers and mothers of each other. Does anyone else feel anything about this?

I feel this is everyone's issue. It is about equal rights. I am with you. I don't know the best path to securing these rights. However; I do believe that the first step is a constitutional amendment declaring us "all equal: race, nationality, gender, or sexual orientation." This is an essential first step because many States discriminate on the fact that sexual orientation is not listed in the Constitution. This amendment would make us equal in all ways legally. This would lay the foundation for Gay marriages.

 

[LesterM]

Thank you Rifle, Marky and jayman I am facing the day feeling not so alone. That is also a great benefit of this forum

 

[mikeyank]

A drag queen who just didn't want to be arrested one more time at Stonewall made it possible for Adam and me to register in a New York hotel just as surely as Rosa Parks made it possible for Lena Horne to fly first class. And any self-loathing, arrogant, pseudo-intellectual ass who thinks he has the right to pick and choose the freedoms and individuals who deserve those freedoms, be he 18, 35, or 110, can spend his life in any Middle Eastern country of his choosing.

You are so correct rifle. As I used to try to argue with a former member of this forum, how can you as a gay man not see that what Rosa Parks championed is no different from our struggle. We are all human beings, children of God, and we all deserve equal rights. To use a phrase from my college days, Right on!

Mike

 

[Jayman01]

god damn anyone who says that what happens to a fourteen year old gay student in chicago who gets picked on in class or an eighty one year old gay man in florida who gets threatened as he walks to the grocery has nothing to do with him. A drag queen who just didn't want to be arrested one more time at stonewall made it possible for adam and me to register in a new york hotel just as surely as rosa parks made it possible for lena horne to fly first class. And any self-loathing, arrogant, pseudo-intellectual ass who thinks he has the right to pick and choose the freedoms and individuals who deserve those freedoms, be he 18, 35, or 110, can spend his life in any middle eastern country of his choosing. I intend to fight with my last breath to insure that my husband and i, that our three sons, that every lgbt person i know or will ever know shares equally in the rights and responsibilities of citizenship in this country. No gay man should ever say he didn't vote or he doesn't care. I am considerably older than markymark, but i swear, if you do, the two of us will spank your twinkie little butts. (and furthermore, speaking for myself, i will try not to enjoy it!) marky - you must try also!

lol

 

[Markymark]

lol

Why can't I enjoy it...a little. At my age, I takes what I gets! LOL! Like that vid a few months ago where they playfully used the belt on each other....OH Baby, cum to daddy! You've been such a naughty naughty boy!

Ok, back down to earth, I have to finish packing for this weekend. Let's see,
1. Chaps
2. Vest
3. Kilt
4. Socks
5. Boots
6. Underwear, no skip that.
7. Leather jockstrap
8. Chain mail jockstrap
9. What am I forgetting?

 

[Jayman01]

Why can't I enjoy it...a little. At my age, I takes what I gets! LOL! Like that vid a few months ago where they playfully used the belt on each other....OH Baby, cum to daddy! You've been such a naughty naughty boy!

Ok, back down to earth, I have to finish packing for this weekend. Let's see,
1. Chaps
2. Vest
3. Kilt
4. Socks
5. Boots
6. Underwear, no skip that.
7. Leather jockstrap
8. Chain mail jockstrap
9. What am I forgetting?

Flashes, codpiece, and perhaps a riding crop... maybe

 

[Markymark]

Flashes, codpiece, and perhaps a riding crop... maybe

Thanks, Jay, now I have to repack! Let's see, dildoes, lubes, condoms, riding crop, codpiece, flashes, dog tags, collars, oh, fuck, CAMERAS! I knew I was forgetting something important! There, now I'm ready. OK Patrick, bring 'em on! (Happy Thoughts, Happy Thoughts)

 

[Jayman01]

Thanks, Jay, now I have to repack! Let's see, dildoes, lubes, condoms, riding crop, codpiece, flashes, dog tags, collars, oh, fuck, CAMERAS! I knew I was forgetting something important! There, now I'm ready. OK Patrick, bring 'em on! (Happy Thoughts, Happy Thoughts)

Maybe you could call you son Prince Tyler. I hear through the grapevine that he has access camera and will travel.

 

[Jayman01]

Oh, yeah, you may need extra batteries just in case of an an emergency too.

 

[Markymark]

I never pack without at least one item which has Panasonic on it somewhere. You know, a tv, a dvd, a super deluxe sidewinder butt plug. . . .

Well, at least you buy american, that's good for the economy! I plan to do plenty of different stuff while in the city, including some politicking for gay rights. Thanks everyone for your comments on this thread ( in both veins).


Iam,

 

[Kodieboy]

What i cant understand is why havent we,got GAY RIGHTS world wide already.. why with all our family and friends dont we out number the norrow minded ness of the wankers that oppose it

 

[Jayman01]

I have been debating with myself about posting this thread. I decided to go ahead.
I have gotten into discussions with Mitch and we know that there were problems there that were insurmountable by me. One of the things he wrote that bothered me tremendously was that as an older gay man he really didn't care if marriage rights were passed because he did not see that as an option for himself at this time of life. I realize that he is not here to defend that statement and I hope I am doing him justice by stating his thought as he would have stated it. If I have not I apologize.However, the problem is bigger than just a discussion here on the forum. I have spoken to other older gay men who have expressed the same opinion. If the generations before us don't care I do not see how we can win the fight for true and honest equal rights in this country. I have spoken to many other people who feel the fight involves all of us ,gay and lesbian and no matter what age and if the rights we fight for will be used or not. I feel that if we are not granted full unequivical rights we will never be given full respect and people will still panic if the word homosexual is used around children. I knew I was gay at a very early age . I was not recruited and I did not choose to be gay, it is a part of me as is my hair , eye and skin color.I am outraged that we are asked to pay full taxes with out full rights. I think it is time for all of us to band together as brothers , sisters, fathers and mothers of each other. Does anyone else feel anything about this?

What i cant understand is why havent we,got GAY RIGHTS world wide already.. why with all our family and friends dont we out number the norrow minded ness of the wankers that oppose it

Lester and Kodieboy, I am so with you on this issue. We are all equal and we are "One Nation." Yes, I know a lot of the older gays don't see this as an issue. Shame on them. However; I think you may find that many of the older Gays that are not in support of this topic never found true love either. It is just a theory but it would be an interesting survey to take. I could be wrong with this assumption; I know that many of the older gays faced a lot of persecution and were forced back into the closets they came out of just to survive. It pains me that some of these older GLBT individuals are afraid to make a stand. Do to their age or whatever. We need to unite to win our rights as equals in this country... We need strong leaders and advocates to press these issues forward.

 

[Kodieboy]

Lester and Kodieboy, I am so with you on this issue. We are all equal and we are "One Nation." Yes, I know a lot of the older gays don't see this as an issue. Shame on them. However; I think you may find that many of the older Gays that are not in support of this topic never found true love either. It is just a theory but it would be an interesting survey to take. I could be wrong with this assumption; I know that many of the older gays faced a lot of persecution and were forced back into the closets they came out of just to survive. It pains me that some of these older GLBT individuals are afraid to make a stand. Do to their age or whatever. We need to unite to win our rights as equals in this country... We need strong leaders and advocates to press these issues forward.

I can only talk for people i know over here and in nsw,but i know people up to the age of 60... and they feel the same.. and they know people older.

So i dont get it ... Equal rights ..... should just be, why anyone in this day and age ... can denigh someone that is ludicrus..

And the sad part is proberably the people saying no ... and holding back our rights , cant say no to a 5yr old throwing a tantrum.

But have no probs saying no to ... how many people in the world.


Here one for you ........ all i could say when i found this was ..... ooooooowww ... left me speachless..

 

[Jayman01]

I can only talk for people i know over here and in nsw,but i know people up to the age of 60... and they feel the same.. and they know people older.

So i dont get it ... Equal rights ..... should just be, why anyone in this day and age ... can denigh someone that is ludicrus..

And the sad part is proberably the people saying no ... and holding back our rights , cant say no to a 5yr old throwing a tantrum.

But have no probs saying no to ... how many people in the world.


Here one for you ........ all i could say when i found this was ooooooowww ... left me speachless..

Way to go Kodiboy.

 

[tampa24]

There is still allot of ignorance and fear out there. Straight people feel threatened by our chance at marriage. As if it diminishes their own marriages. I don't see the logic there. But the ignorant and the hatemongers love to trot out that line of reasoning.

I was surprised and mildly amused last year when the gay student group of my former alma mater, with which I am still on an email list, sent me a notice stating that Mike Hackabee once advocated quarantining gay people. The person sending the email was shocked to find this out. I wrote the young woman back and told her that in the mid to late 80's on that many of the American televangelists of the day called for a gay quarantine. With the AIDS epidemic and the hysteria that the far right tried to whip up, that they wanted to send all gay men to what amounted to leper colonies. Whether they had AIDS or not. In many ways I'm amazed at how far we've come since those days. I'm still aware also though of how far we have to go to get full acceptance and equality. Like the black movement though we may likely get more equality through the courts before we get acceptance from our fellow citizens.

Wow. Post number 600. Kewl...

 

[Kodieboy]

Sadly to say you are right.

 

[Jayman01]

There is still allot of ignorance and fear out there. Straight people feel threatened by our chance at marriage. As if it diminishes their own marriages. I don't see the logic there. But the ignorant and the hatemongers love to trot out that line of reasoning.

I was surprised and mildly amused last year when the gay student group of my former alma mater, with which I am still on an email list, sent me a notice stating that Mike Hackabee once advocated quarantining gay people. The person sending the email was shocked to find this out. I wrote the young woman back and told her that in the mid to late 80's on that many of the American televangelists of the day called for a gay quarantine. With the AIDS epidemic and the hysteria that the far right tried to whip up, that they wanted to send all gay men to what amounted to leper colonies. Whether they had AIDS or not. In many ways I'm amazed at how far we've come since those days. I'm still aware also though of how far we have to go to get full acceptance and equality. Like the black movement though we may likely get more equality through the courts before we get acceptance from our fellow citizens.

Wow. Post number 600. Kewl...

You are so right on with that comment Tampa...