British and American Attitudes Towards Displays of Emotion.

[tampa24]

British and American Attitudes Towards Displays of Emotion

Stiff upper lip and denying or suppressing any human emotion ??? We are not North Korea, China or Zimbabwe. Maybe you are referring to the Royal Family but even they have dropped their emotional guard over the last 15 years.

[I had written out this post and realized that it would drag the intended thread way off topic. So I decided to post it here. That way we could start a new conversation here if anyone is interested.]


Well, keeping in mind that I've got over a 20 year head start on you, that was the Britain that was portrayed to us in the U.S. The royal family had alot to do with that of course. But even beyond the royals it appeared to us that any show of emotion (even happiness) was frowned upon if it was deemed to be "excessive". Unless it was for something like a sporting event. Beyond that, shedding tears, crying, and so on, appeared to be considered in very poor taste if done outside a funeral parlor perhaps. Something to be done in private if one couldn't control him/her-self. But very uncouth to do in public. Very important to maintain British reserve.

And of course homosexuality was illegal in Britain and punishable by prison terms until 1967. Most of know what happened to Oscar Wilde and even Alan Turing for instance. Turing being the mathematical genius and hero who helped decipher the cracked Nazi war codes during WWII in the ultra secret "Enigma" project. Then a grateful nation threw him in prison for being gay. In 1967 England and Wales decriminalized homosexuality. It was still officially illegal in Scotland until February 1, 1981. And it was still (officially at least) illegal in Northern Ireland until December 8th 1982. I bring this up not as a sport to bash Britain. Because I know the U.S. is far from perfect. Civil Rights here are still a work in progress. Those are some of the things I was getting at though when I said that the British have tended to stifle human emotion. And of course behavior. Not like North Korea though! haha And in fairness there are some anti-sodomy laws in some U.S. states that are still officially on the books. But rather than officially overturning those laws, they are just not enforced. I suspect maybe that was the case for Scotland and Northern Ireland after 1967?

I remember after the death of Princess Diana (GRHS), when the whole country suddenly erupted in an outpouring of grief and emotion. Some British commentators were appalled by the spectacle. They worried that the country had succumbed to a "mass hysteria" as they put it. Because it just wasn't the British way. One was expected to maintain a certain decorum. It appears that much has changed in the kingdom. I freely admit that I am on the outside looking in. I don't live there. So some of my perceptions are likely shaded by outdated stereotypes.

I was just very impressed by how much emotion the young people on the show (X Factor) were willing to demonstrate. Especially the straight men crying and hugging other straight men. It was a very pleasant surprise! I don't think you would see as much of that here in the states. And I had assumed that Britain was much more reserved socially than we are here. Maybe the tables have turned? Is Britain ahead of us on this?

 

[cumrag27]

Talking about strange bed-fellows...

Dear Tampa,

Just like the political term of "Conservative" is easily associated with the UK, but then there is "Conservative(UK)" and there is "Conservative(USA)" and somehow, through our extremist neocons/religous right/tea partiers/and Republicans, it seems that we have resulted with a level of "Conservative" that is here-to-fore unheard of in the UK and has little in common with the UK version. My understanding is that UK Concervatives cannot fully comprehend the level of insanity our conservatives have incorporated in this complex uniquely American political view.

Talking about strange bed-fellows, I feel a lot of this hysteria is largely due to the liason of the American Fundamentalist Christian Evangelicals and the equally disturbing connection with the Catholic Hierarchy - primarily Bishops, Cardinals, and a few Priests that feel they must walk "in locked-step' with their higher-ups lost in their pattern of denial of reality! This attitude really 'es me off! With their history of "child abuse" on a large scale and "shamefully not reporting the abusing priest directly to the proper law-enforcement authorities", I guess out of sheer guilt they feel they must over-compensate by supporting the secretive church hierarchy or fear being outed for past sins.

When I was growing up Catholic throughout the 1960's, I was proud of the Catholic's firm stance against racial prejudice in the turbulent times the USA was going through. Priest, Sisters, and other Catholic religious routinely marched in support of Civil Rights "Freedom Marches" in the USA. Unfortunately, these remaining brave souls have mostly retired by now and there is a glaring lack of real leadership when it comes to "Human Rights" in our Church. As a Catholic, it seems to me that American Catholic Leaders have suffered a hostile take-over by narrow-minded religious conservatives that were formerly only in the distant background in my youth. I recently read a news item that some Catholic Priest or Bishop commented two days ago that (under our current Pope) we have gone back some 200 years in our collective social conscience instead of opting to remain relevant to Christ's message and the needs of people today. I grudgingly have to concur with his disappointing opinion of where we stand today!

Sincerely politically and religiously turned off,



Stimpy

 

[peterh6308]

This thread is exactly one of the main reasons I continue my monthly membership. There are a handful of such educated individuals on here that tend to know a little more about certain subjects then I do, and I love the fact I can watch great porn and learn something (all in the same 1/2 hour). Thanks everyone for your continued opinions!

 

[joninliverton]

Tampa you certainly need to get across here someday. Your interpretation of the UK is very way off what it is today. Your refer to homosexuality being illegal until 1967, that is probably true but it was also illegal and still is in many parts of the world. The British Stonewall society were amongst the first to get sexual equality in the Western world - a feat some of your states have yet to achieve. The Brits were also way ahead of the USA when it came to allowing gays and lesbians into their armed first. The grief shown by Princess Diana's death was because people actually loved her - didn't the Americans grieve and weep for JFK and Martin Luther King ?

Maybe our stiff upper lip is something to do that our policemen don't walk around with shotguns in their hands, but then again we have controlled gun law/control. Sure there are some leaks in the law that led to such mass murderers as Michael Ryan (Hungerford), Thomas Hamilton (Dunblane) and Derek Bird (Workington), but no system will totally eradicate guns, but we try, unlike your good selves which allow anyone to buy a weapon from a gun supplier. The 3 people I name above span a period of nearly 40 years, the USA has had 3 mass shootings this summer.

Sorry Tampa, but your post was quite offensive and I suggest you check your own back yard before firing bullets across the pond.

 

[tampa24]

Dear Jon,

It was not meant to be offensive. But if you took it that way, then I do apologize. The whole intent was to make my point about why I was surprised that I saw so many Brits (namely heterosexual males) displaying so much emotion and displays of affection towards other men. I just found that surprising. Since the stereotype in my mind was that British subjects are more reserved in displays of emotion and/or affection.

I do not fault your countrymen for crying and grieving when Princess Diana died. I cried too. My mother cried. Of course people cried here when JFK and MLK died. The death of Princess Diana shook me in a way that I had not expected. I felt like I had lost a dear cousin. Almost like a member of my extended family. I went out and bought 5 British tabloids during the week following her death. My surprise though was not that people in Britain grieved as much as they did. It was at how much some British commentators were up in arms because they thought the displays of public grief were excessive. Like they expected their countrymen to show nearly the same stoicism during her funeral as they exemplified during the Blitz.

I very much admire British culture and all of its numerous contributions to western society. Not the least of which was standing up to Hitler alone for nearly 3 years and ultimately defeating him. They saved all of us in the western world from a regime that would have taken us back to the Dark Ages. It's always been one of my lifelong dreams to visit the mother country. If I gave you the opposite impression, then again I apologize. My post was intended to get your feedback on British attitudes towards displays of affection and so on. I have opened the door to ask you (and any other Brits among us in here) if my impressions are actually stereotypes. And to get truer portrait of British social attitudes in the 21st century from those who actually live there.

 

[joninliverton]

The UK is now such a diverse and open place to live that whatever happens here that causes public reaction, there will be an opposite reaction by some factions and certainly this relates to the media. Regarding the death of Princess Diana, ff there had not been so much public grieving then commentators would have asked why.

There are many examples of this though and I do not think we are unique. Britain won a record amount of gold medals in this years olympics but some members of the press still complained instead of embracing in the success. The England cricket team recently lost it's world nr 1 spot to South Africa, but instead of accepting that SA were a better side, some of the press ripped into our team.

Living in such a free, open and multi cultural society has it's positives but also many negatives and freedom of speach allows the press to say virtually whatever they want - hence the recent Levison enquiry. Saying that of course the press will unite like a swarm of bees if someone like Romney comes over and has a go at us as he did prior to the olympic games. If he gets to president and I hope to god he doesn't, his first visit had better be with an olive branch.

And yes we do still have pomp and ceremony such as the military parades and the state opening of parliament, but without this Britain would not be Britain. We are a nation built on history and our cities and towns reflect this with castles, stately homes and other old buildings that are older than the USA. But this is what attracts the tourists, many from the USA, so it is very important to the uk economy that we keep our heritage, which includes the royal family.

 

[tampa24]

It sounds like a lovely place Jon. I think one of the benefits of living on an island or even a rather small country, is that you are born and raised with a strong sense of belonging to particular geographical area. Add to that a place with all the history, culture and vast global contributions of a nation like Britain, and I'm sure it's a wonderful place to live.

In a country the size of the U.S. we are very patriotic of course and have much to be proud of in our own global contributions. Wherever we live on this vast continent, we feel very strongly American. But then for those of us who have moved around alot there comes the question of, Where is home? For me I was born in California, raised in Ohio, grew up visiting family in Missouri often and now happily live in Florida. And I still have family in all those places. The farthest west, the middle center, the far north to the Great Lakes and now in one of the easternmost states. But where would I want to be buried at the end of the journey? Which place in my heart of hearts would be "home". The truth is...I'm not sure. I imagine that those of you in places like Britain don't have as much of a struggle with questions like that.

 

[joninliverton]

You have to look at the proportion of the UK that is populated to that of the USA. I class our counties similar to the 50 odd states that you have over there. The only difference is, is that we have the same laws in each county... in other words its a uk law. I have family all over england and wales but burial doesnt bother me cos I'm gonna get burnt.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwMa3wDUcBQ

 

[joninliverton]

There is a new BBC series being launched in 2 weeks regarding the stiff upper lift of the British but be warned it will probably be targeted at the well to be and not the ordinary people.

 

[angelone]

Compared with the Japanese or Saudi royal families, I think the British royal family is a lot more people-friendly and human. Thanks to the free-press in Britain, we can see and read the successes, challenges and foibles of the young royals which makes them more like the rest of us. Now who was it that went naked in a Las Vegas hotel? God he was handsome!